Well said that lady!
Saw this on a group. Made me chuckle so much I had to share it!
Showing posts with label ATOS. Show all posts
Showing posts with label ATOS. Show all posts
Friday, 10 May 2013
Sunday, 21 April 2013
Please think before complaining.
I just saw this posted on one of the benefits groups.
Feel Free to let Atos know how you feel about them .
They have a Freepost address it will cost them to hear your opinion :
Letters , Postcards ,Parcels , should be sent to the following address
Please keep all mailing polite and legal .
Atos
Wyman Dillon Research
Freepost (B57607)
Bristol
B535 3YA
Please share the address.
My ONLY gripe with Atos is that their receptionists were too slow, therefore claiming that we arrived late when we didn't, and that they (Atos) tried to fob me
off on my own GP for the WCA. Hardly what the benefits group are
expecting people to complain about, is it.
What they really need to be doing is
complaining to the DWP!!! Atos aren't responsible for the things people
have problems with. It's our flipping government!
By all means, write to Atos at the above address IF you have a problem with them, but PLEASE check first that your gripe is with them, and not with the DWP.
- It is the DWP, not Atos, who determine how frequently you are assessed.
- It is the government, not Atos, who chose the ridiculous computerised system that is used (by Atos) to perform the assessments.
- It is that computerised system, that makes the assumptions based on the boxes ticked, that usually piss people off - assumed to be "lies told by the assessor".
- It is the DWP, not Atos, who decide whether or not to use the recommendation that comes from the Work Capability Assessment.
- etc.
Yes, I know there are times when the assessors do tell lies. But, before complaining to Atos about it, look carefully at the paperwork and try to determine whether it really is the assessor telling lies, or whether it is a tick box on a computer making assumptions.
My own Atos assessor did include some blatant lies at my medical, so I did place an official complaint. These lies were mostly regarding the physical; she claimed that I was able to do things that I had not been able to do on the day, for example how far forward I was able to bend. She also claimed that I had no walking aids, when I had my stick, and that I walked with no problem to the assessment room, when I clearly fell against one of the doors. Most of what the assessor inputs manually (and therefore personally) is regarding your physical, and your personal appearance and behaviour at the assessment.
When reports contain incorrect things about these, it is fair to make a complaint to Atos, but when a report says, for example "Can fill a front loading washing machine", when the assessor has asked you no such thing, it is simply because the computer has made an assumption. By all means, go through the report and note where it is incorrect for your appeal, but there is no point in complaining about these to Atos; the government (the DWP I believe) picked that computer system, so it is their responsibility!
Similarly, if the report says "walks dog daily", when you did not tell the assessor this, consider whether you told the assessor that you have a pet dog. The computer assumes that you care for the pets you tell the assessor about; so if you are unable to walk the dog you need to specify this to the assessor. Incidentally, if you have a cat, or small animal, the computer assumes that you are capable of regular planning; you are able to feed and care for this animal in the appropriate manner every day (even if the animal is dead in it's cage, rotting, at home). You need to be specific with your assessor; that is your responsibility, not Atos, and not the DWP.
If in doubt, make a complaint to Atos, but also make a complaint to the DWP.
Incidentally, the Atos address isn't exactly secret information. If you phone them, telling them you wish to make a complaint they'll send you the GL24 form (which you can also find online), and a free post envelope.
Atos aren't a company with the primary aim of doing harm to people. They are an Information Technology Services Company. Computers!
Monday, 24 December 2012
My benefit claims
I've been working on my own benefit claims over the last month or so; ESA and DLA. I have to say that I am sincerely disappointed with the DWP. Until now I had pretty much given them the benefit of the doubt; I thought that the employees were not to blame for how the system works, but as much victims of it as the claimants. Just part of the machine.
I can now categorically tell you that, sometimes, they do not even look at our application forms before making a decision. I realised after posting my DLA form that I had not signed it. I therefore fully expected it to be turned down, with a letter asking me to resubmit it, having sign it. However, what I actually received was a fail based on the medical assessment I had for ESA 18 months ago.
I will point out at this juncture, that the medical 18 months ago was over-turned immediately. It was wrong, the assessor had made unreasonable assumptions based on no evidence, which I clearly illustrated to the DWP as soon as I received her report. I received ESA from a reconsideration, and placed a complaint against the assessor to Atos. (Atos of course defended her).
While it is outrageous that they are using outdated evidence, that is not my point. Had they actually looked at my form they would have realised straight away that they could turn it down based on the lack of signature. They didn't look at it! That is disgusting. Do they have the slightest idea of how much effort, how much energy, how much blood sweat and tears, go into those forms? I severely neglected Christmas preparations because they expected the form back just before Christmas; my waking hours were utilised on the form (plural actually, as I had my ESA50 too). They obviously do not care. I wonder how many people are declined at this stage, not realising that their form has not even been looked at, and not aware that they can appeal. I wasn't aware that you could appeal the first time I was declined after all. No one actually teaches you how the system works.
I can't help thinking that it would save them money if they didn't faff around like this, playing silly buggers. If they actually processed peoples claims properly when they were first sent in, based upon their form and accompanying evidence, surely there would be less need for appeals.
Unfortunately, my experience with ESA is no better. In fact I think I would go as far as to say it's worse. It's a lot more complicated though, so if you cannot follow what I try to explain now, don't worry too much about it.
Whilst getting divorced in 2010 I applied for ESA over the phone. The DWP friendly telephonist I spoke with checked that I had enough National Insurance Credits to claim Contributions Based ESA. My ex had tried to scare me, telling me that I hadn't paid enough of them, which is why we checked, and why it is so memorable that I did have enough of them. (My ex was trying to scare me regarding money in a lot of ways). So, I applied for CB-ESA, got through the application process, and started receiving ESA basic rate.
At the beginning of November I moved into my own flat (call this location A), so changed my address over the phone with the DWP. A couple of weeks later in November I received my divorce settlement. I phoned the DWP to find out if this had any baring on my claim, as I had heard that it could do. I was told that I would no longer receive ESA payments, but that my National Insurance would still be credited. It's a shame that I did not know the system so thoroughly then, as what he told me was wrong and I would have recognised it.
In December I went to stay elsewhere (call this location B) while problems with my flat were sorted out, so I phoned the DWP and gave them the new address again. At that time I was not informed of any problems with my claim.
I moved again in March due to problems with location B, and location A never got sorted out (so call this location C). I contacted the DWP again to give them the address for location C. I was told that they could not change the address on a closed claim. I asked when the claim had been closed, and was told it had been closed in the November, when I had told them about the divorce settlement. I was astounded, as I had not been told in November that he was closing my claim, nor had I received any paperwork to that affect.
When I had returned to location A to check I'd got everything, I found two
letters from the DWP; one summoning me for a medical assessment, and
another telling me that because I had not attended the medical
assessment my benefit would be revoked. They were dated February, and
expected me to be at the medical a few days before I found the letters.
So they had screwed up:
- they should not have discontinued a Contributions Based ESA claim based upon a divorce settlement. Contributions Based ESA is not means tested.
- if my claim was closed in November 2011, and you cannot change the address on a closed claim, then I should not have been able to change my address in December.
- when my claim was closed, I should have received paperwork to inform me.
- if my claim was closed in the November, I should not have been summoned for a medical assessment in February.
So, recently, my GP gave me a fit note to cover me for two months. He wanted me to have some income. I wasn't sure what you do with fit notes, so I phoned the DWP to ask. I spoke to one of their helpful telephonists (as opposed to the unhelpful ones), who tried her best to initiate an ESA claim for me, but just could not do it. My record was screwed. Every time she tried to start a claim the computer gave her an error. She probably should not have told me that really. Anyway, she put a request in for me to be sent an ESA1 in the post so that I could fill it in manually and return it myself.
I received the claim pack for Housing Benefit.
I received the claim pack for Carers Allowance.
I received the claim pack for some Disability thing I've never heard of.
Eventually an ESA1 arrived.
On the ESA1 you have to decide whether you wish to claim for Contributions Based ESA, or Income Related ESA. Being aware that my record was a complete mess I thought I'd better check what state my National Insurance was in, so, again I phoned the DWP. I was given a different number to contact the NI Office. I spoke to a lovely man who told me that I have three years of Class 1 credits, should have no problem placing a claim, and that he was disgusted that I was having to do the DWPs legwork for them.
So, confident that they'd screwed my record up enough for me to claim Contributions Based ESA, I ticked that box. Surprise surprise; I received notification back that I do not have enough NI to claim Contributions Based. I already know I can't claim Income Related because my other half's earnings are above the threshold, despite the fact that his outgoings don't allow him to support me.
I'm stuck in a rut. I have made my MP aware of the situation. She is trying to get my National Insurance sorted out, but I suspect that when it is sorted out it will still not be the right kind of credits to claim ESA. She has also given me a supporting letter for my DLA reconsideration, as she was already aware of my health before any of this happened.
Over the last few weeks, working on these claims, I have found out a couple of things that people with M.E. may find interesting:
M.E. claimants, along with claimants who suffer from mental health conditions, are given time limit concessions. That means that they are expected to get their forms back a little late. The DWP telephonists aren't actually aware of this, so if you're phoning the DWP to inform them of lateness, you'll need to explain it to them. It's also a good idea to remind decision makers in a note with your claim. I wouldn't advise returning your form late if you can avoid it, and certainly not weeks late.
M.E. is assessed as CFS by Atos. The Atos guidelines for assessing CFS
do not tell the assessor what kind of condition it is, but give them the
choice as to whether they assess it as a physical condition, a
psychological condition, or a mixture of both. Personally, I don't like this. M.E. is recognised by the WHO and NICE as being a neurological condition, with neurological indicators. The DWP is supposed to use doctor's to assess neurological conditions, but M.E. is exempt from this. I was assessed by a nurse. I know others who have been assessed by physiotherapists, health workers, etc. The reason for this is, apparently, that people with M.E. do not show neurological indicators. Well; I know I do. I also know that they are described in some detail on my form. As such I SHOULD be assessed by a doctor, but can guarantee I will not be.
Honestly, it probably doesn't make any difference. I just feel indignant that M.E. is degraded in this way.
Wednesday, 19 December 2012
Petition worth signing!
Yeah yeah, I know there are loads of these things going around. Most of them are really naff though, written by someone with half a brain who is angry over something so they've whipped up a really badly worded petition in five minutes, without thinking it through properly. This one is NOT one of those. This one is very well thought through, asks for what we seriously need, and should actually be taken seriously by parliament because of how it is written.
Personally, I have given up on parliament. I think they are throwing out everything that comes their way if it isn't in their interests. I think we no longer have a proper democratic government, but that's a totally different matter. It's worth trying, so please sign it.
We call for:
A Cumulative Impact Assessment of all cuts and changes affecting sick & disabled people, their families and carers, and a free vote on repeal of the Welfare Reform Act.
An immediate end to the Work Capability Assessment, as voted for by the British Medical Association.
Consultation between the Depts of Health & Education to improve support into work for sick & disabled people, and an end to forced work under threat of sanctions for people on disability benefits.
An Independent, Committee-Based Inquiry into Welfare Reform, covering but not limited to: (1) Care home admission rises, daycare centres, access to education for people with learning difficulties, universal mental health treatments, Remploy closures; (2) DWP media links, the ATOS contract, IT implementation of Universal Credit; (3) Human rights abuses against disabled people, excess claimant deaths & the disregard of medical evidence in decision making by ATOS, DWP & the Tribunal Service.
I am unfamiliar with what an Impact Assessment is, but we do need someone unbiased to seriously look into why the cuts and changes to everything are affecting the sick and disabled so much more than the rich. Asking for the ability to vote on such changes is genius.
In case you are unaware, the British Medical Council voted that the Work Capability Assessment - that scary medical you're sent for if you wish to claim Employment & Support Allowance - be ended. I agree 100% with this request, though am uncertain of how practical it is. There needs to be something in place. Personally I'd appreciate it if they took the ESA50 and medical evidence seriously in the first place.
Again, I agree 100% with ending forced work for the sick and disabled. Personally, I want to work, and I like the idea of gradually being re-introduced to it. BUT I do not think it should be forced upon anyone, and am disgusted that they take away 70% of someone's benefit if they cannot make it to that work. The nature of being sick and disabled means they will be unable to attend at times.
And yes oh YES, please please can there be an inquiry into all of the above. Independent and unbiased. The problem I have with inquiries is that they nearly always find what the government to find though. Either that of the government just ignores them.
Tuesday, 18 December 2012
MP wants your story!
Michael Meacher MP wants your views and experiences of Atos / DWP. He is building a dossier to present to parliament in order to argue for radical changes to the current incompetent system. I emailed him mine yesterday. Below you will find part of his reply to me, describing exactly what he would like from people. So, please, if you have something you can share with him, do so. It may only be something trivial, but it will all count.
"Can I please ask you to confirm your address and postcode and if possible a short statement about your case which briefly sets out the order of events with ATOS together with the dates?
"If you are not one of my own constituents, I will not be able to take up your individual case with your local agencies I'm afraid, as this must be carried out by your own MP. But it would be very useful to make use of your experiences when I make representations about the ATOS system as a whole.
"Can you kindly confirm that you would be happy for me to use your details in this way? Also, would you be willing to be contacted in the event of any interest from the press or broadcast media?"
If you have something to offer, you can email him here: michael.meacher.mp@parliament.uk
Yesterday I told him that my view is that the DWP doesn't know their arse from their elbow, and that a computer systems company should not be performing health assessments that affect peoples lives in a crucial manner, let alone with a system that was thrown out by the country that designed it. Today, following his official request I gave him the following story. I hope it gives you an idea of what to say. I did tell him that he could cut the first paragraph out if it isn't helpful to him.
"I suffer with Myalgic Encephalomyelitis, Fibromyalgia, Hypermobility, Hypothyroidism, displaced vertebrae and anxiety (PTSD). Between the conditions they cause debilitating pain in almost every part of my body, extreme unremitting exhaustion, too many difficulties to list briefly. I am unable to work, though I wish more than anything to do so. I am unable to live any sort of normal life; I can't have a social life. My GP is concerned for my mental well being. I have been on suicide watch for the last 8 months. The last thing people in my condition need is added stress. Having no income is extremely stressful.
"I used to work full time, and expected to do so my whole life. When I became ill I was totally unaware of how the benefit system worked. I was misled by Job Centre employees, being told to live on loans and that my house mates had to support me. When someone is extremely ill, they are not up to researching the complications of the benefit system, and assume that what they are told by officials is correct. It should be made clear to ill people that they can get help. In the last two years I have had severe problems with the DWP. I was placed on Income Related ESA when I should have been placed on Contributions Based ESA. Because of that error my claim was closed when I received some money; had I been on Contributions Based ESA, this would not have happened. The claim should not have been closed; the DWP should have continued to pay my National Insurance Contributions. I was not informed that it was closed. As such, now, when I have no money, I am unable to claim Contributions Based ESA because of mistakes the DWP made. I cannot claim Income Related ESA because my boyfriends earnings are over the threshold, despite the fact that his outgoings are nearly more than his incomings. I understand that Income Related ESA should be means tested, but I also believe it should be based on what is left after outgoings, rather than being based on what comes in. I recently applied for DLA, but it has been turned down based upon an ESA medical that was performed two years ago and overturned at the time. My DLA application form was totally ignored; this too should not happen, especially when using out of date evidence."
I am really glad to know that we have MPs on our side. I received an email today from my own MP saying that she is willing to write me a supporting letter for my DLA reconsideration, as she personally knows that what was written in their report is untrue (due to my previous communications with her on another matter). It feels like we're starting to round that corner, make a tiny bit of progress. I can almost see light at the end of the tunnel.
I do hope it doesn't turn out to be a train.
Wednesday, 12 December 2012
Support Group Descriptors
The previous post lists the point scoring system used with the descriptors for the ESA50 & WCA. As stated in that post, you need 15 points to get ESA. If you score 15 points in only one section you will be placed in the ESA Support Group, as opposed to the Work Related Activity Group. The other way to be placed in to the Support Group is to meet one of the descriptors below.
If you are unfamiliar with the terms used above, please see this post.
Support group descriptors
|
ESA Descriptors
When you apply for Employment & Support Allowance (ESA), you receive a form called the ESA50. This form, and the Work Capability Assessment (WCA - the Atos medical assessment) are scored on a point system. The DWP / Atos use "descriptors" to award these points. The descriptors are below. The points are in blue after each descriptor. I have explained in my previous blog post the best way to use them.
You need at least 15 points to get ESA.
Limited Capability for Work Descriptors
Points are indicated in blue
beneath the descriptor
Descriptors and scores for each physical
activity
Mobilising
unaided by another person with or without a walking stick, manual wheelchair or
other aid if such aid can reasonably be used.
(a) Cannot either:
(i) mobilise more than 50 metres on level ground without stopping
in order to avoid significant discomfort or exhaustion;
or
(ii) repeatedly mobilise 50 metres within a reasonable timescale
because of significant discomfort or exhaustion.
15
(b) Cannot mount or descend two steps unaided by another person
even with the support of a handrail.
9
(c) Cannot either:
(i) mobilise more than 100 metres on level ground without stopping
in order to avoid significant discomfort or exhaustion;
or
(ii) repeatedly mobilise 100 metres within a reasonable timescale
because of significant discomfort or exhaustion.
9
(d) Cannot either:
(i) mobilise more than 200 metres on level ground without stopping
in order to avoid significant discomfort or exhaustion;
or
(ii) repeatedly mobilise 200 metres within a reasonable timescale
because of significant discomfort or exhaustion.
6
(e) None of the above apply
2. Standing
and sitting.
(a) Cannot move between one seated position and another seated
position located next to one another without receiving physical assistance from
another person.
15
(b) Cannot, for the majority of the time, remain at a work
station, either:
(i) standing unassisted by another person (even if free to move
around); or
(ii) sitting (even in an adjustable chair) for more than 30
minutes, before needing to move away in order to avoid significant discomfort
or exhaustion.
9
(c) Cannot, for the majority of the time, remain at a work
station, either:
(i) standing unassisted by another person (even if free to move
around); or
(ii) sitting (even in an adjustable chair) for more than an hour
before needing to move away in order to avoid significant discomfort or exhaustion.
6
(d) None of the above apply
3. Reaching.
(a) Cannot raise either arm as if to put something in the top
pocket of a coat or jacket.
15
(b) Cannot raise either arm to top of head as if to put on a hat.
9
(c) Cannot raise either arm above head height as if to reach for
something.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
4. Picking
up and moving or transferring by the use of the upper body and arms.
(a) Cannot pick up and move a 0.5 litre carton full of liquid.
15
(b) Cannot pick up and move a one litre carton full of liquid.
9
(c) Cannot transfer a light but bulky object such as an empty
cardboard box.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
5. Manual
dexterity.
(a) Cannot either:
(i) press a button, such as a telephone keypad; or
(ii) turn the pages of a book with either hand.
15
(b) Cannot pick up a £1 coin or equivalent with either hand.
15
(c) Cannot use a pen or pencil to make a meaningful mark.
9
(d) Cannot use a suitable keyboard or mouse.
9
(e) None of the above apply.
6. Making self
understood through speaking, writing, typing, or other means normally used,
unaided by another person.
(a) Cannot convey a simple message, such as the presence of a
hazard.
15
(b) Has significant difficulty conveying a simple message to
strangers.
15
(c) Has some difficulty conveying a simple message to strangers.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
7.
Understanding communication by both verbal means (such as hearing or lip
reading) and nonverbal means (such as reading 16 point print) using any aid it
is reasonable to expect them to use, unaided by another person.
(a) Cannot understand a simple message due to sensory impairment,
such as the location of a fire escape.
15
(b) Has significant difficulty understanding a simple message from
a stranger due to sensory impairment.
15
(c) Has some difficulty understanding a simple message from a
stranger due to sensory impairment.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
8.
Navigation and maintaining safety, using a guide dog or other aid if normally
used.
(a) Unable to navigate around familiar surroundings, without being
accompanied by another person, due to sensory impairment.
15
(b) Cannot safely complete a potentially hazardous task such as
crossing the road, without being accompanied by another person, due to sensory
impairment.
15
(c) Unable to navigate around unfamiliar surroundings, without
being accompanied by another person, due to sensory impairment.
9
(d) None of the above apply.
9. Absence
or loss of control leading to extensive evacuation of the bowel and/or bladder,
other than enuresis (bed-wetting) despite the presence of any aids or
adaptations normally used.
(a) At least once a month experiences:
(i) loss of control leading to extensive evacuation of the bowel
and/or voiding of the bladder; or
(ii) substantial leakage of the contents of a collecting device
sufficient to require cleaning and a change in clothing.
15
(b) At risk of loss of control leading to extensive evacuation of
the bowel and/or voiding of the bladder, sufficient to require cleaning and a
change in clothing, if not able to reach a toilet quickly.
6
(c) None of the above apply.
10.
Consciousness during waking moments.
(a) At least once a week, has an involuntary episode of lost or
altered
15
Consciousness resulting in significantly disrupted awareness or
concentration.
(b) At least once a month, has an involuntary episode of lost or
altered consciousness resulting in significantly disrupted awareness or
concentration.
6
(c) None of the above apply.
Descriptors and scores for each mental,
cognitive and intellectual function assessment
11. Learning
tasks.
(a) Cannot learn how to complete a simple task, such as setting an
alarm clock.
15
(b) Cannot learn anything beyond a simple task, such as setting an
alarm clock.
9
(c) Cannot learn anything beyond a moderately complex task, such
as the steps involved in operating a washing machine to clean clothes.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
12.
Awareness of 15 everyday hazards (such as boiling water or sharp objects).
(a) Reduced awareness of everyday hazards leads to a significant
risk of:
(i) injury to self or others; or
(ii) damage to property or possessions such that they require
supervision for the majority of the time to maintain safety.
15
(b) Reduced awareness of everyday hazards leads to a significant
risk of:
(i) injury to self or others; or
(ii) damage to property or possessions such that they frequently
require supervision to maintain safety.
9
(c) Reduced awareness of everyday hazards leads to a significant
risk of:
(i) injury to self or others; or
(ii) damage to property or possessions such that they occasionally
6
(d) None of the above apply.
13.
Initiating and completing personal action (which means planning, organisation,
problem solving, prioritising or switching tasks).
(a) Cannot, due to impaired mental function, reliably initiate or
complete at least 2 sequential personal actions.
15
(b) Cannot, due to impaired mental function, reliably initiate or
complete at least 2 personal actions for the majority of the time.
9
(c) Frequently cannot, due to impaired mental function, reliably
initiate or complete at least 2 personal actions.
6
(d) None of the above apply
14. Coping
with change.
(a) Cannot cope with any change to the extent that day to day life
cannot be managed.
15
(b) Cannot cope with minor planned change (such as a pre-arranged
change to the routine time scheduled for a lunch break), to the extent that
overall day to day life is made significantly more difficult.
9
(c) Cannot cope with minor unplanned change (such as the timing of
an appointment on the day it is due to occur), to the extent that overall, day
to day life is made significantly more difficult.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
15. Getting
about.
(a) Cannot get to any specified place with which the claimant is
familiar.
15
(b) Is unable to get to a specified place with which the claimant
is familiar, without being accompanied by another person.
9
(c) Is unable to get to a specified place with which the claimant
is unfamiliar without being accompanied by another person.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
16. Coping
with social engagement due to cognitive impairment or mental disorder.
(a) Engagement in social contact is always precluded due to
difficulty relating to others or significant distress experienced by the
individual.
15
(b) Engagement in social contact with someone unfamiliar to the
claimant is always precluded due to difficulty relating to others or
significant distress experienced by the individual.
9
(c) Engagement in social contact with someone unfamiliar to the
claimant is not possible for the majority of the time due to difficulty
relating to others or significant distress experienced by the individual.
6
(d) None of the above apply.
17.
Appropriateness of behaviour with other people, due to cognitive impairment or
mental disorder.
(a) Has, on a daily basis, uncontrollable episodes of aggressive
or disinhibited behaviour that would be unreasonable in any workplace.
15
(b) Frequently has uncontrollable episodes of aggressive or
disinhibited behaviour that would be unreasonable in any workplace.
15
(c) Occasionally has uncontrollable episodes of aggressive or
disinhibited behaviour that would be unreasonable in any workplace.
9
(d) None of the above apply.
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